News - Throop Former United Church and Manse Update 2014-2016

NEW - Monday, 21st July 2014 // LAST UPDATED - Tuesday, 23rd February 2016

UPDATED - Tuesday, 23rd February 2016

The United Reform Church in Throop and the Manse have now been sold and the new owners will be bringing it back into family accommodation. Further details to follow.

UPDATED - Monday, 15th June 2015

Update on the Church and Manse at Throop from residents questions 9th June 2015

Information supplied by former Councillor Ron Whittaker

Email Reply from Ruth Povey, Planning Officer (Design and Heritage) Planning, Transport and Regulation, Bournemouth Council
8th June 2015
RE: Planning applications, any update

Dear Ron

That's good timing of you - I've just today received a pre enquiry on the church! A meeting has been requested to discuss residential conversion. If a subsequent application is received I'll let you know.

Unfortunately I've still not received the revised application for The Manse - I'll try chasing the agent for the withdrawn application, hopefully that might spur them into action.

Regards,
Ruth,
Planning Officer (Design and Heritage) Planning, Transport and Regulation, Bournemouth Council

UPDATED - Friday, 17th April 2015

Email Reply from Councillor Ron Whittaker
16th April 2015
RE: Throop United Reformed Church

Ruth.

Thank you as always, it seems that I will have to leave it to others after the election to ensure whatever is planned fits well within the Throop village conservation area, will naturally be keen to see what happens and would naturally like to see the application when it does come forward to planning.

But again my thanks Ruth. You know how I feel about the history of the church as does the village.

Councillor Ron Whittaker

Email from Ruth Povey, Planning Officer (Design and Heritage) Planning, Transport and Regulation, Bournemouth Council to Councillor Ron Whittaker
16th April 2015
RE: Throop United Reformed Church

Morning Cllr Whittaker

I am still awaiting the resubmission of the application at the Manse. As yet I haven't received any formal communication on the church, although an agent happened to mention they had been instructed to draw up a scheme for the new owners. I took the opportunity to reiterate my offer to give some early feedback on any proposals - but as yet I've not received anything.

Despite encouraging engagement with us it is a little frustrating that I've not heard back on either the Manse or the church.

Regards,
Ruth,
Planning Officer (Design and Heritage) Planning, Transport and Regulation, Bournemouth Council

UPDATED - Friday, 20th March 2015

Email Reply from Councillor Ron Whittaker
17th March 2015
RE: Throop United Reformed Church

Ruth.

Thank you and hope the new owners will now engage with you as to their plans for the church and more so engage with the residents of the village and chair of the civic society, especially relating to the internal sections of the church as a grade 2 listed church as they cannot move any parts of the pews / altar, here they need to take advice also from E.H. any response please let me know Ruth. Thanks

Councillor Ron Whittaker

Email from Ruth Povey, Planning Officer (Design and Heritage) Planning, Transport and Regulation, Bournemouth Council to Councillor Ron Whittaker
17th March 2015
FW: Throop United Reformed Church

Dear Cllr Whittaker

As requested, please find below a copy of the email I sent via Mr Bizzey to the new owner of the church. Hopefully the new owner will take up this offer of early engagement over their future plans for the building.

Regards,
Ruth,
Planning Officer (Design and Heritage) Planning, Transport and Regulation, Bournemouth Council

Email from Ruth Povey, Planning Officer (Design and Heritage) Planning, Transport and Regulation, Bournemouth Council to Edward Bizzey, Clanfield Properties Ltd
13th March 2015
Throop United Reformed Church

Mr Bizzey. As discussed please could you forward on this email. Regards Ruth

Dear Sir/Madam

I hope you do not mind me contacting you through Mr Bizzey, my hope is that you will find this a helpful approach. I was pleased to learn that Throop United Reformed Church in Bournemouth had been sold and I understand you are the new owner.

The Church is an important building in Throop and the Council is keen to see it in use once again to secure its long term future. I would encourage you to engage with the Planning Department to discuss your future plans for the building. With the building situated in a conservation area and being grade II listed any potential alterations will require careful consideration.

The Council offers a pre application advice service (a fee applies) however at this early stage you are welcome to drop me an email with some detail of your plans and I will provide some brief feedback on the principle in response. If you prefer to have an initial chat on the phone, you can reach me through the Customer Services Team on 01202 451323.

I look forward to hearing from you.

Regards,
Ruth,
Planning Officer (Design and Heritage) Planning, Transport and Regulation, Bournemouth Council

UPDATED - Monday, 16th February 2015

E-mail Reply from Councillor Ron Whittaker
15th February 2015
Throop Church and Manse

Edward,

Thank you as always, and note all you say about who the purchaser of the church as a private treaty, would have thought who ever would wish to bring on board the local residents, look forward to seeing the new / fresh application for the Manse again thank you for all your time, really mean that.

Councillor Ron Whittaker

E-mail Reply from Edward Bizzey, Clanfield Properties Ltd
15th February 2015
RE: Throop Church and Manse

Cllr Whittaker

Your continued attempts are noted. We have a duty not to disclose who the purchaser of the church is because it is a private treaty sale. The church will form part of a planning application that we have no party to. Access to the graveyard and etc has been dealt with in the transaction rest assured.

The planning officer involved is aware of the situation with regards The Manse. We had to go away and re work the application as we were asked to make changes. Those have been done and a fresh application will be submitted next week. Your officers are aware that we have been working hard to get this right.

Please understand we have and continue to commit considerable funds and time to get this right. It is and remains a very complicated planning application.

Kind regards
Edward Bizzey, Clanfield Properties Ltd.

E-mail from Councillor Ron Whittaker to Edward Bizzey, Clanfield Properties Ltd
15th February 2015
Throop Church and Manse

Edward,

Today [Sunday] like all weekends over the past years have been checking out both the sites / building of the Church and Manse, it is so noticeable that the listed boundary wall is under further deterioration / cracking due to the trees roots pressing against the wall.

Again residents are asking why if someone has as you say brought the church why the secrecy as to who the private individual is, you say not at liberty to say! WHY, would have thought anyone who has invested in the building, which as we know is grade 2 listed, would now be making plans to start whatever in a formal pre-application advice as to what is intended internally within the building. By so doing work with the community.

Other matter is yes to church yard and ensuring access at all times, plus maintenance.

Councillor Ron Whittaker

UPDATED - Monday, 9th February 2015

E-mail from Councillor Ron Whittaker to Edward Bizzey, Clanfield Properties Ltd
7th February 2015
RE: Throop Church and Manse

Edward.

As I am stepping down from Council in May, and not surprisingly residents are asking endlessly as to when one will know as to what is happening with the Former UNITED REFORM CHURCH. Listed grade 2, and been now closed for near 5 years, over those years I have written over a hundred emails / letters to the trust, now more so when in May 2010 the secretary of St. Peter and St Pauls Orthodox Church had written to me a detailed letter requesting much interest in the building to house THEN their growing congregation at the small Winton church, SADLY for whatever reason even after endless emails from the Secretary and promises that someone from the trust and then the agents would get back, they never did, WON'T HERE GO FUTHER INTO DETAIL OVER THE YEARS, but you said last month that the "church has been brought by a private individual for their use" and you said "you were not at liberty to say yet but would introduce you as soon as possible".

As this building is grade 2 and internal sections of the church are protected.

See no application has yet been forward to the planning section of the council or no pre-apps, one can only ask again especially with the weather conditions badly effecting both the church and Manse buildings that 2015 might eventually see something happening after 5 years.

Councillor Ron Whittaker

E-mail from Edward Bizzey, Clanfield Properties Ltd to Councillor Ron Whittaker
16th December 2014
RE: Throop Church and Manse

Ron

We are working on getting this exchanged as we speak. It is being bought by a private individual as for the use they want I am not at liberty to say yet. However I will introduce you as soon as possible.

Kind regards
Edward Bizzey, Clanfield Properties Ltd.

UPDATED - Friday, 31st October 2014

E-mail Reply from Councillor Ron Whittaker
29th October 2014
RE: Throop Church and Manse

Katherine yes likewise, it been now some 4 plus years with endless ongoing emails / letters with Wessex Trust, residents are watching developments closely regarding access to the rear grave yard. And ongoing maintenance to the church grounds, plus all the internal listed parts of the church, one presumes HE have been involved with both buildings.

Councillor Ron Whittaker

E-mail Reply from Katherine Cartwright, Planning Officer (Heritage), Bournemouth Council
29th October 2014
RE: Throop Church and Manse

Dear Cllr Whittaker

As soon as I receive the application for consultation I will send the link from the website through to you so you can view the plans. As for the church I believe that the churches internal processes are slowing the sale of the property down but believe it is in hand. I am hopeful something will happen on this site soon.

Kind Regards,
Katherine Cartwright,
Planning Officer (Heritage) MRTPI, Design and Heritage Team, Planning, Transport and Regulation, Bournemouth Council

E-mail Reply from Councillor Ron Whittaker
29th October 2014
RE: Throop Church and Manse

Katherine.

Thanks, keep being told by Edward contracts are shortly to be exchanged on the Church, this is months ago, would appreciate any news on MANSE and link when it comes through for the Portal, again thank you Katherine.

Councillor Ron Whittaker

E-mail Reply from Katherine Cartwright, Planning Officer (Heritage), Bournemouth Council
29th October 2014
RE: Throop Church and Manse

Dear Cllr Whittaker

Although this was submitted on the portal yesterday it has not made its way to me yet via the registration team. I believe an extension is proposed for the rear of the Manse as well as the refurbishment and upgrading of the principal building. Nothing has come through for the church yet as I believe the sale is still going through on the building. As soon as this is complete I would expect an application through for any proposed use on the site from the new occupier.

Kind Regards,
Katherine Cartwright,
Planning Officer (Heritage) MRTPI, Design and Heritage Team, Planning, Transport and Regulation, Bournemouth Council

E-mail from Councillor Ron Whittaker to Katherine Cartwright, Planning Officer (Heritage), Bournemouth Council
29th October 2014
RE: Throop Church and Manse

Katherine, can you give me indication now what is being proposed on both the buildings and one now presumes a planning application.

Councillor Ron Whittaker

E-mail from Edward Bizzey, Clanfield Properties Ltd to Councillor Ron Whittaker
28th October 2014
Throop Church and Manse

Cllr Whittaker

The Listed Building Planning Application was submitted via the portal yesterday.

I hope this eases your frustration!

Kind regards
Edward Bizzey, Clanfield Properties Ltd.

UPDATED - Friday, 17th October 2014

E-mail from Katherine Cartwright, Planning Officer (Heritage), Bournemouth Council to Councillor Ron Whittaker
16th October 2014
Manse

Dear Cllr Whittaker

I have been informed by Mr Bizzey that an application will be with us for the refurbishment of the Manse by the end of October so I am hopeful that we are making progress on the Manse as well as the church.

Kind Regards,
Katherine Cartwright,
Planning Officer (Heritage) MRTPI, Design and Heritage Team, Planning, Transport and Regulation, Bournemouth Council

UPDATED - Tuesday, 7th October 2014

E-mail from Councillor Ron Whittaker to Charles Raven, Bournemouth Council Officer
6th October 2014
RE: Throop Church and Manse

Charles,

As you know have for past months been trying to find out as to the Wessex Trust plans for both these listed buildings Throop Church being grade 2 and closed from 2009, one now only has to see the much deterioration to both the exterior, let alone what the interior of the buildings are now like, as you know from May 2010 when interest was shown by the secretary of the Winton Orthodox Church for active discussions with Wessex Trust, although correspondence was sent to the trust they just ignore all communications, over the last years we have received promises of interest, and that church ready to exchange contracts, June/July/Aug so on and still nothing happening, we are told Bournemouth Architect dealing with Manse, yet still NO RESPONSE to my email to the agent appointed, meantime the village, residents just need to know WHAT is happening.

When in 2010 the ORTHODOX CHURCH were planning subject to any talks to see this listed grade 2 1826 returned back to Christian worship, with winter now well on us are we to see another year of further to the fabric of both buildings.

Think the time should now be to make representation to both English Heritage and Society for the Protection of Ancient Buildings.

Councillor Ron Whittaker

E-mail from Councillor Ron Whittaker to Edward Bizzey, Clanfield Properties Ltd
1st October 2014
RE: Throop Church and Manse

Edward.

One must ask again what is happening with the planned church exchange and Manse, it is really sad to see to listed buildings suffering from deterioration to the out fabric of the buildings.

Over past 4 years I have had so much correspondence with the trust and it seems nothing has changed.

Councillor Ron Whittaker

E-mail from Councillor Ron Whittaker to Edward Bizzey, Clanfield Properties Ltd
18th September 2014
Throop Church and Manse

Edward.

9th August your email made reference to "Church ready to exchange next week or so", doing my regular visits the grave yard is looking good, but sadly still see nothing moving as to the church, also know architect is dealing with Manse as you have said, sadly no movement on clearance of the overgrowth, one area is the front wall where large gaps are showing in the brick work where pressure is pushing the wall out, plus the reported damage to that section of wall.

Councillor Ron Whittaker

UPDATED - Thursday, 14th August 2014

Photos of the growth in the grounds of Throop Church and Manse plus Damage to Wall

Throop Church Grounds Growth, Bournemouth
Throop Manse Grounds Growth, Bournemouth
Throop Church Manse Wall Damage, Bournemouth
UPDATED - Monday, 11th August 2014

E-mail from Councillor Ron Whittaker to Edward Bizzey, Clanfield Properties Ltd
9th August 2014
RE: Throop [Former United] Church and Manse

Edward.

Having today [Saturday] spent an hour with some residents looking at the appalling further/endless deterioration to the Manse and yes our listed CHURCH BUILDING.

In July I made further reference to the overgrowth state of the Manse grounds, appreciate you are working on a listed building application but that is no excuse for the owners to totally neglect the grounds, including the serious damage to the listed wall which told was done by contractor manoeuvring a skip.

AS YOU CAN SEE FROM TWO PHOTOS A RESIDENT HAS TAKEN TODAY OF THE DAMAGE TO THIS WALL.

Throop Church Manse Damage, Bournemouth 1
Throop Church Manse Damage, Bournemouth 2

Without me again and again repeating ALL PAST HISTORY of the site, I cannot believe that the trust has over past 4 years plus allowed both buildings to become in such a rundown state.

You mention in past email that the church is under offer, intention you said to become a commercial/studio space, so far no application has come forward to the authority on both buildings.

When one goes back to my endless correspondence with the trust where the Coptic Orthodox Church of Bournemouth wanted so much to open talks / negotiations as they were very keen to see both buildings to be maintained as a place of Christian worship. In 2013 I like all my past emails asked that someone returned Nader Francis calls.

Like I have said before, I could go on and on...

Councillor Ron Whittaker

E-mail Reply from Councillor Ron Whittaker
20th July 2014
RE: Throop [Former United] Church and Manse

Edward,

Thank you, that was a swift reply, but it really does little to reassure me. Yes fully appreciate anything to do with listed building application can take some time, question is why over the four years was the building left so long to get into this state, especially when as I have said the Orthodox Church was so interested.

APPRECIATE NONE OF THIS IS DOWN TO YOURSELF.

Unfortunately the reply does not deal with present position of the state of the Manse grounds and boundary listed wall.

As I pointed out over the years had lots of promises. My letter to Mr. Maclean in 2010 giving details and request achieved nothing, which then led to ongoing emails and eventually action taken by myself a chairman of the local civic society and residents to deal with THEN the state of both front of church yard and rear grave yard, hence then it forced the Wessex Trust to act, retain photos of the then state of the church yard.

As said appreciate none of the past history is down to you, but think someone needs to get the manse grounds cleared and attention given to the boundary wall.

Councillor Ron Whittaker

E-mail Reply from Edward Bizzey, Clanfield Properties Ltd
20th July 2014
RE: Throop [Former United] Church and Manse

Cllr Whittaker

Nothing is ever as simple as we all like it to be. I have assured you as best I can as to the current situation and will continue to do so. However your emails although I understand the content will not speed up the process that is complicated no matter how much you try to simplify it.

The church is under offer still and will exchange contracts when legally it is ready to do so.

The Manse is being retained by the church. They are in the process and a very detailed and complicated one of getting a Listed Buildings Application ready. It is detailed and will save and preserve the Manse long term.

I ask that you take my word that this is an ongoing situation that has mine and Stuart MacLeans utmost attention whilst other detailed projects allow. Trust me it is complicated and far from straight forward.

I am of course happy to discuss if you think it would help.

With kind regards.
Edward Bizzey, Clanfield Properties Ltd.

NEW - Monday, 21st July 2014

E-mail from Councillor Ron Whittaker to Edward Bizzey, Clanfield Properties Ltd
20th July 2014
Throop [Former United] Church and Manse

Edward.

Firstly am grateful that wherever you try to keep me in the loop on any likely progress on the two listed properties, have had some near 60 endless and then ongoing communications with Wessex Trust in the early part of 2010 and onwards, so appreciate you were not involved in those days, but looking today (Sunday) at the grounds of the MANSE front and rear, it becomes extremely upsetting to the village to see a once proud building that brought residents of the village much joy in the days when church organisations had fetes / cream teas etc.

NOW ONLY to see the massive OVERGROWTH to the front and rear of the Manse, including the bowing out of the Protected wall by two bush like trees which are causing the likely collapse of the brick wall.

The whole of the Manse is just an endless deterioration, and YES VERY DEPRESSING to the village, as to the Church one is told that OFFER ON CHURCH BACK LAST YEAR, June this year that contracts will be shortly exchange and Manse application to refurbish will be submitted shortly [June].

Edward I have heard all of this so many times, in 2010 we were told then by the Trust the Manse was to receive a full repairing lease by then Christmas 2010. Like I have said have so many emails/letters of endless assurance, who does one believe, whoever is, to occupy the Church my advice would be to them is to make yourself friendly by at least circulation, a letter of their intention to the village. As it is we see both buildings showing much deterioration when in 2010 the ORTHODOX CHURCH IN WINTON wrote me a very detail letter as they and three other churches were showing interest.

Sadly for whatever reason no ever got back to the Secretary of St. Peters and St Pauls Coptic Orthodox Church, a lovely man whose wish was to purchase or rent due then to his growing congregation at Winton. As pointed then out they were then in a good position to purchase a bigger church, as I have said no one ever got back to Nader Francis.

AS YOU CAN SEE ALL OF THE LAST 4 YEARS HAS BEEN A TOTALLY DEPRESSING TIME TO SEE WHAT COULD OF HAPPEN TO BOTH THESE LOVELY ONCE BUILDINGS, CHURCH DATES FROM 1826.

Councillor Ron Whittaker